Comments on: Confessions Of An (Almost) Religious Hitman http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/ Online travel magazine dedicated to exploring travel in the 21st century. Offering travel news, compelling interviews, online travel tools, and more. Sat, 20 Mar 2010 11:07:09 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: Jared Krauss http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-93513 Jared Krauss Tue, 11 Aug 2009 22:08:39 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-93513 Being a former missionary it saddens me to be informed of activities like this. However, I must put forth my somewhat coinciding and contradicting view point. Somewhere around 30 or 35 years ago there were reports of Christian missionaries traveling to the South Pacific and other places in South East Asia, but more specifically Papa New Guinea. Their goal was to reach tribes that hadn't been preached to, to expose them to the Christian religion. Whether or not that was appropriate is debatable, but that is a whole other argument, so let's ignore that part. However, instead of speaking with these people and letting them get to know them as a people and see how they live their life and explain to them their beliefs and allow them to make their own decisions, they would storm into the villages and destroy any symbol of their pagan or otherwise beliefs. They essentially force fed Christianity to them. Being a Christian, this sickens me, it freezes me to my core. I despise anyone capable of doing something like this. (That is my somewhat coinciding view point.) However, when I traveled to Panama at the age of fifteen with twenty other teenagers and two adults, all of whom I had never met before and who had never met each other, that was not our goal. Our mission was to simply share our knowledge, to bring some joy and caring to anyone and everyone we met. We hiked for a day, after driving for hours from David, to reach the village of Alto Caballeros. While there we would split into groups of two or three and walk the village over and to the nearby dwellings, offering our assistance in anyway possible. My group ended up finding a gentlemen who was rebuilding his home and digging away into the mountain side to expand it.( His home was not covered in siding and a perfect roof-it was made from bamboo covered with palm leaves) I spent my time every day for a week simply going to his house and helping him build, I never tried to force my beliefs upon him, I let him ask the questions. Him and his family were both very curious as to my beliefs. At the end of the week on my last day, which they knew, it was like every other day. I helped them work and bid them farewell. They didn't "convert", but perhaps they learned something, perhaps in a years time they will make their own decision to join Christ. (My somewhat contradicting opinion.) We didn't go there to force feed anyone, and as far as my knowledge goes, we didn't. All I ask is that you don't allow one or a few examples, of how religion can be just as filled with lies and deceit as the evil they are trying to protect the world from, spoil your entire view on a religion. If we allowed ourselves that foolish, ignorant view point we would never respect Christians, Muslims, Zen Buddhists, Jews, and so on and so forth. Just as so many on this website tell everyone to keep an open mind, eye and ear it pains me to see people closing each and everyone of those. Salam Alaykum, Jared Krauss Being a former missionary it saddens me to be informed of activities like this. However, I must put forth my somewhat coinciding and contradicting view point.
Somewhere around 30 or 35 years ago there were reports of Christian missionaries traveling to the South Pacific and other places in South East Asia, but more specifically Papa New Guinea. Their goal was to reach tribes that hadn’t been preached to, to expose them to the Christian religion. Whether or not that was appropriate is debatable, but that is a whole other argument, so let’s ignore that part. However, instead of speaking with these people and letting them get to know them as a people and see how they live their life and explain to them their beliefs and allow them to make their own decisions, they would storm into the villages and destroy any symbol of their pagan or otherwise beliefs. They essentially force fed Christianity to them.
Being a Christian, this sickens me, it freezes me to my core. I despise anyone capable of doing something like this.
(That is my somewhat coinciding view point.)
However, when I traveled to Panama at the age of fifteen with twenty other teenagers and two adults, all of whom I had never met before and who had never met each other, that was not our goal. Our mission was to simply share our knowledge, to bring some joy and caring to anyone and everyone we met. We hiked for a day, after driving for hours from David, to reach the village of Alto Caballeros. While there we would split into groups of two or three and walk the village over and to the nearby dwellings, offering our assistance in anyway possible. My group ended up finding a gentlemen who was rebuilding his home and digging away into the mountain side to expand it.( His home was not covered in siding and a perfect roof-it was made from bamboo covered with palm leaves) I spent my time every day for a week simply going to his house and helping him build, I never tried to force my beliefs upon him, I let him ask the questions. Him and his family were both very curious as to my beliefs. At the end of the week on my last day, which they knew, it was like every other day. I helped them work and bid them farewell. They didn’t “convert”, but perhaps they learned something, perhaps in a years time they will make their own decision to join Christ. (My somewhat contradicting opinion.)
We didn’t go there to force feed anyone, and as far as my knowledge goes, we didn’t. All I ask is that you don’t allow one or a few examples, of how religion can be just as filled with lies and deceit as the evil they are trying to protect the world from, spoil your entire view on a religion. If we allowed ourselves that foolish, ignorant view point we would never respect Christians, Muslims, Zen Buddhists, Jews, and so on and so forth.
Just as so many on this website tell everyone to keep an open mind, eye and ear it pains me to see people closing each and everyone of those.

Salam Alaykum,
Jared Krauss

(Report comment)

]]> By: PJ http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-93246 PJ Sat, 01 Aug 2009 18:15:39 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-93246 Quality is many times more important than quantity. Many beliefers proudly claim themselves as majority. The suspiscion is all around that (undercover) missionarists are trying to convert other beliefers into their faith. Interesting is that it's mainly the Muslims they are targeting. It's a threat for Muslims. But i may say the best protection for Muslims is to make attempts in improving their own understanding of their belief. Also the Christians/Hindus, etc do of their own beliefs in case it happened to them (A Muslimah, insha Allah) Quality is many times more important than quantity. Many beliefers proudly claim themselves as majority.
The suspiscion is all around that (undercover) missionarists are trying to convert other beliefers into their faith. Interesting is that it’s mainly the Muslims they are targeting. It’s a threat for Muslims. But i may say the best protection for Muslims is to make attempts in improving their own understanding of their belief. Also the Christians/Hindus, etc do of their own beliefs in case it happened to them

(A Muslimah, insha Allah)

(Report comment)

]]> By: Baxter http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-90372 Baxter Sat, 02 May 2009 06:28:25 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-90372 Rich Slimbach is a professor of TESOL at Azuza Pacific University (the same univeristy that was prepared to offer me a cut-rate MA in TESOL in exchange for some back-alley preaching and a few hush-hush conversions there). What 's interesting and telling about his post is that he didn't identify himself as such. Richard Slimbach, Ph.D. Professor, Department of Global Studies, Sociology, and TESOL College of Liberal Arts and Sciences Rich Slimbach is a professor of TESOL at Azuza Pacific University (the same univeristy that was prepared to offer me a cut-rate MA in TESOL in exchange for some back-alley preaching and a few hush-hush conversions there). What ’s interesting and telling about his post is that he didn’t identify himself as such.

Richard Slimbach, Ph.D.
Professor, Department of Global Studies, Sociology, and TESOL
College of Liberal Arts and Sciences

(Report comment)

]]> By: Baxter http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-89322 Baxter Tue, 14 Apr 2009 09:27:05 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-89322 Alright then, so I'm not just preaching to the choir. Hallelujah! So, anyone doing something under false pretenses has no integrity and the road to hell is paved with good intentions. I've actually known a few undercover missionaries and even taught at a university in Cairo that was founded with the express purpose of converting Muslims. My motives for writing this article were to expose these Christians who say one thing but do the other. You know, the hypocrites. For me, God is the truth and anything I can do to bring us closer to it is just me bringing my own light to the sum of all others. Thanks for weighing in on this and salem mailekum (Peace be upon you), Baxter Alright then, so I’m not just preaching to the choir. Hallelujah!

So, anyone doing something under false pretenses has no integrity and the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

I’ve actually known a few undercover missionaries and even taught at a university in Cairo that was founded with the express purpose of converting Muslims.

My motives for writing this article were to expose these Christians who say one thing but do the other. You know, the hypocrites.

For me, God is the truth and anything I can do to bring us closer to it is just me bringing my own light to the sum of all others.

Thanks for weighing in on this and salem mailekum (Peace be upon you),
Baxter

(Report comment)

]]> By: Rich Slimbach http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-89288 Rich Slimbach Sun, 12 Apr 2009 15:21:39 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-89288 Thanks for you post, Baxter. Manipulation and deception, especially in matters as personal and consequential as faith, is inexcusable. But to lump together a wildly diverse group of people (call them "missionary English teachers") and brand them as secret agents, cloak-and-dagger proselytizers, or the like only degrades your intelligence and their integrity. Really, how many of these "imperial troopers" have you personally befriended? How much of their teaching have you actually observed? On what basis are you able to decipher their actual intentions and motivations? (You seem to be unsure whether or not their work is fueled by "outright deception and manipulation" or "well intentioned motives.") Perhaps you could clarify the motives that you know best--your own. Is your aim to use extremism (characterization) to spark an active, opposing consensus to extremism? Or do you imagine something grander, like cleansing English language teaching worldwide of anyone who embraces such contagious superstitions as divine love, forgiveness, and human liberation? That would be a fairly heady "mission" in its own right, although already commissioned by an evangelical atheist "priesthood" (Julian Edge, Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, Daniel Dennett, Chris Hitchens, etc.; no "priestesses"?), espousing doctrines that ring with religious-like certainty. Together they are prepared to exorcise the world of that most debilitating curse: faith. Do you wish that we should join them? Thanks for you post, Baxter. Manipulation and deception, especially in matters as personal and consequential as faith, is inexcusable. But to lump together a wildly diverse group of people (call them “missionary English teachers”) and brand them as secret agents, cloak-and-dagger proselytizers, or the like only degrades your intelligence and their integrity. Really, how many of these “imperial troopers” have you personally befriended? How much of their teaching have you actually observed? On what basis are you able to decipher their actual intentions and motivations? (You seem to be unsure whether or not their work is fueled by “outright deception and manipulation” or “well intentioned motives.”) Perhaps you could clarify the motives that you know best–your own. Is your aim to use extremism (characterization) to spark an active, opposing consensus to extremism? Or do you imagine something grander, like cleansing English language teaching worldwide of anyone who embraces such contagious superstitions as divine love, forgiveness, and human liberation? That would be a fairly heady “mission” in its own right, although already commissioned by an evangelical atheist “priesthood” (Julian Edge, Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, Daniel Dennett, Chris Hitchens, etc.; no “priestesses”?), espousing doctrines that ring with religious-like certainty. Together they are prepared to exorcise the world of that most debilitating curse: faith. Do you wish that we should join them?

(Report comment)

]]> By: Baxter http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-89221 Baxter Thu, 09 Apr 2009 09:48:30 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-89221 Thanks ya'll for reading and weighing in on this issue. Really appreciate your comments. Nothing more dangerous than self righteouness combined with good intentions, is there? Thanks ya’ll for reading and weighing in on this issue. Really appreciate your comments.

Nothing more dangerous than self righteouness combined with good intentions, is there?

(Report comment)

]]> By: Hal http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-89214 Hal Wed, 08 Apr 2009 19:46:14 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-89214 bringing education, economic development, and social resources to areas that need it: +. peddling religion, covertly or otherwise: -. Great article, Baxter. bringing education, economic development, and social resources to areas that need it: +. peddling religion, covertly or otherwise: -.

Great article, Baxter.

(Report comment)

]]> By: Bruce http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-89212 Bruce Wed, 08 Apr 2009 18:23:58 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-89212 I agree with the opinions of Carlo and Don above. If you are living to let your light shine, then people will be attracted to what you are doing and want to know why you are doing it. They can then decide through their own study. Understanding and not conversion should be the mission. We want Muslims to be tolerant of those who are not as well as visa versa. Stop the covert proselyting! Give freely to the "Samaritans" in your life without making it necessary for them to accept all your beliefs. One of the scary things about Muslim law is the death penalty for apostasy. That is a relative opinion that can span a lot of territory but Christian conversion is definitely one of those violations. I say teach but stop breaking the law of the land where you live. I agree with the opinions of Carlo and Don above. If you are living to let your light shine, then people will be attracted to what you are doing and want to know why you are doing it. They can then decide through their own study. Understanding and not conversion should be the mission. We want Muslims to be tolerant of those who are not as well as visa versa.

Stop the covert proselyting! Give freely to the “Samaritans” in your life without making it necessary for them to accept all your beliefs. One of the scary things about Muslim law is the death penalty for apostasy. That is a relative opinion that can span a lot of territory but Christian conversion is definitely one of those violations.
I say teach but stop breaking the law of the land where you live.

(Report comment)

]]> By: Madison the Mermaid http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-89205 Madison the Mermaid Wed, 08 Apr 2009 14:31:57 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-89205 I agree with Cate and Don, if you aren't going to teach strictly English then don't go at all. I never understood the reason for conversion except for their own personal game of adding notches to their belts of Christianity. Leave these people alone, or do the job you were sent to do instead of some secret mission or your own personal vendetta. I agree with Cate and Don, if you aren’t going to teach strictly English then don’t go at all. I never understood the reason for conversion except for their own personal game of adding notches to their belts of Christianity. Leave these people alone, or do the job you were sent to do instead of some secret mission or your own personal vendetta.

(Report comment)

]]> By: DHarbecke http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/07/confessions-of-an-almost-religious-hitman/comment-page-1/#comment-89203 DHarbecke Wed, 08 Apr 2009 13:51:10 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=794#comment-89203 If you want to know why these groups are spending money to convert people, you have to ask how they got the money to spend in the first place. It'd be nice to let people be content in their beliefs, but people who aren't of the faith don't pay in. Any faith that has to sell itself is already untrustworthy. If you want to know why these groups are spending money to convert people, you have to ask how they got the money to spend in the first place. It’d be nice to let people be content in their beliefs, but people who aren’t of the faith don’t pay in.

Any faith that has to sell itself is already untrustworthy.

(Report comment)

]]>