Comments on: Khmer Kids: Why Abstract Thought Is More Than You Think http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/ Online travel magazine dedicated to exploring travel in the 21st century. Offering travel news, compelling interviews, online travel tools, and more. Sat, 20 Mar 2010 11:07:09 -0700 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: george http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-96033 george Thu, 24 Dec 2009 01:32:16 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-96033 Wow...I've been here in the US for almost 28 years. I still can not understand the abstract world as you painted in your writing. But can understand your students. I came ere to the US in 1982 from Cambodia. I went to high school here and some college courses. I understood what you are writing about but i just tried to imagin what on those of your students' mind. In Cambodia we dont have Pizza that much. and parties are almost always at a restaurant or some open place. no hats, no wine glasses like America, that's why they couldn't grasp the pictionary you were describing. I considered me lucking understanding both world. I appreciate what you write. Good read... funny but sometime sad tat Cambodia as such a backward place. Wow…I’ve been here in the US for almost 28 years. I still can not understand the abstract world as you painted in your writing. But can understand your students. I came ere to the US in 1982 from Cambodia. I went to high school here and some college courses. I understood what you are writing about but i just tried to imagin what on those of your students’ mind. In Cambodia we dont have Pizza that much. and parties are almost always at a restaurant or some open place. no hats, no wine glasses like America, that’s why they couldn’t grasp the pictionary you were describing. I considered me lucking understanding both world. I appreciate what you write. Good read… funny but sometime sad tat Cambodia as such a backward place.

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]]> By: monty http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-95651 monty Mon, 30 Nov 2009 07:32:37 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-95651 I don't understand the overwhelming obsession with trying to make these kids think like westerners. The Khmer have survived in a culture that has persisted for more than a thousand years and yet a few well-meaning foreigners want to change that? This reminds me of missionaries travelling to Africa, South America and North America when those regions were "discovered" and forcing their cultures on the indigenous peoples of those areas. Those natives were viewed as backwards and they needed to learn the western way to improve themselves. Having said that, I agree that there is a place for learning to express abstract thought. If the children want to learn how westerners think it may be better suited to post-secondary. I see more benefit in teaching the kids English to allow them to teach us about their culture. I don’t understand the overwhelming obsession with trying to make these kids think like westerners. The Khmer have survived in a culture that has persisted for more than a thousand years and yet a few well-meaning foreigners want to change that? This reminds me of missionaries travelling to Africa, South America and North America when those regions were “discovered” and forcing their cultures on the indigenous peoples of those areas. Those natives were viewed as backwards and they needed to learn the western way to improve themselves.

Having said that, I agree that there is a place for learning to express abstract thought. If the children want to learn how westerners think it may be better suited to post-secondary.

I see more benefit in teaching the kids English to allow them to teach us about their culture.

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]]> By: Aline Lindemann http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-91344 Aline Lindemann Thu, 14 May 2009 15:56:17 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-91344 Your piece is fascinating and personally reassuring. My son, adopted from Ethiopia three years ago at the age of six, still struggles with abstract concepts and metaphors. When he first arrived, he looked at the brand new bucket of Legos in the playroom and looked at me like I was ridiculous. There was no formula or picture to copy- did I actually expect him to use his imagination? He is bright, driven, and devours books faster than I can put them on the shelf, but to have a discussion with him about abstract concepts like truth, permanence, or loyalty is a mind-bending venture. Over time, this is changing. He is learning to use metaphors in language. Even better- and true to the survivalist early childhood- he is also learning how to feign understanding when I use them too much in conversation! Your piece is fascinating and personally reassuring. My son, adopted from Ethiopia three years ago at the age of six, still struggles with abstract concepts and metaphors. When he first arrived, he looked at the brand new bucket of Legos in the playroom and looked at me like I was ridiculous. There was no formula or picture to copy- did I actually expect him to use his imagination?

He is bright, driven, and devours books faster than I can put them on the shelf, but to have a discussion with him about abstract concepts like truth, permanence, or loyalty is a mind-bending venture.

Over time, this is changing. He is learning to use metaphors in language. Even better- and true to the survivalist early childhood- he is also learning how to feign understanding when I use them too much in conversation!

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]]> By: Andrew Jiggs http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-90407 Andrew Jiggs Sat, 02 May 2009 19:26:57 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-90407 Fascinating. Part of me is in denial-- no, it's not that first-rate education has opened my mind, it's that they're backward!-- and part of me is humbled at how lucky I am to be able to think abstractly. Fascinating. Part of me is in denial– no, it’s not that first-rate education has opened my mind, it’s that they’re backward!– and part of me is humbled at how lucky I am to be able to think abstractly.

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]]> By: Don Jameson http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-90404 Don Jameson Sat, 02 May 2009 19:08:33 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-90404 The longtime resident of Cambodia and fluent speaker of Khmer Father Ponchaud has stated that the Cambodia language has no words for expressing abstract concepts. If this is true to even speak (or think) abstractly Cambodians must use a foreign language.This may be at the root of the phenonenon you have described. Cambodian has a rich vocabulary for interpersonal relations, which is the almost sole interest of most Cambodians, who normally display litte curiosity about things beyond family and close personal matters. As a consequence, education for the average Cambodian means learning by rote, much the same way as they chant the Buddist scriptures. Thus, for most Cambodians, education in the modern western form is a foreign idea, which is approachable only through the framework of a foreign language and thought process. The longtime resident of Cambodia and fluent speaker of Khmer Father Ponchaud has stated that the Cambodia language has no words for expressing abstract concepts. If this is true to even speak (or think) abstractly Cambodians must use a foreign language.This may be at the root of the phenonenon you have described. Cambodian has a rich vocabulary for interpersonal relations, which is the almost sole interest of most Cambodians, who normally display litte curiosity about things beyond family and close personal matters. As a consequence, education for the average Cambodian means learning by rote, much the same way as they chant the Buddist scriptures. Thus, for most Cambodians, education in the modern western form is a foreign idea, which is approachable only through the framework of a foreign language and thought process.

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]]> By: niamh http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-90316 niamh Fri, 01 May 2009 08:34:38 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-90316 Very interesting article. I worked at an international school in Thailand for while, and had the same cultural issues there. My eventual take on it that it's not so much to do with what happened in Cambodia, just that in the West our approach to education has come to depend so much on abstract and lateral thinking. As a writer with an abstract mind this approach suited me , but to be honest , it just doesn't suit everyone. Lots of Western kids fall through the gaps and miss out on a meaningful education too because they're labelled as ' stupid' or learning disabled as you more tactfully put it. I'm also very involved with the boxing profession and I constantly meet people through this who hated school but are clearly talented and ambitious. We need to find a balance ??? how is another question ! Very interesting article.
I worked at an international school in Thailand for while, and had the same cultural issues there. My eventual take on it that it’s not so much to do with what happened in Cambodia, just that in the West our approach to education has come to depend so much on abstract and lateral thinking. As a writer with an abstract mind this approach suited me , but to be honest , it just doesn’t suit everyone.
Lots of Western kids fall through the gaps and miss out on a meaningful education too because they’re labelled as ‘ stupid’ or learning disabled as you more tactfully put it.
I’m also very involved with the boxing profession and I constantly meet people through this who hated school but are clearly talented and ambitious.
We need to find a balance ??? how is another question !

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]]> By: Colin Wright http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-90291 Colin Wright Thu, 30 Apr 2009 23:54:35 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-90291 Evolving education is an idea that is very near and dear to me, and I'm actually involved with a few projects that are intended to break the barriers between education and those who want it. Shoot me a message if you want to know more, though they are still in the developing stages, so I can't say too much yet :) Very interesting and thought-provoking article! Evolving education is an idea that is very near and dear to me, and I’m actually involved with a few projects that are intended to break the barriers between education and those who want it. Shoot me a message if you want to know more, though they are still in the developing stages, so I can’t say too much yet :)

Very interesting and thought-provoking article!

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]]> By: Kathy http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-90258 Kathy Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:44:14 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-90258 A very interesting piece about serious issues, but I must admit it instantly reminded me of a Star Trek (Next Gen.) episode where Capt. Picard deals with a race that speaks ONLY in metaphors. I've often wondered if that would actually work. [as an aside, I couldn't remember the name of the episode or even any of the alien characters, but I put "star trek picard metaphors" into Google and the correct wikipedia article popped up immediately--another reason thinking abstractly is useful! Here is the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darmok .] A very interesting piece about serious issues, but I must admit it instantly reminded me of a Star Trek (Next Gen.) episode where Capt. Picard deals with a race that speaks ONLY in metaphors. I’ve often wondered if that would actually work. [as an aside, I couldn't remember the name of the episode or even any of the alien characters, but I put "star trek picard metaphors" into Google and the correct wikipedia article popped up immediately--another reason thinking abstractly is useful! Here is the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darmok .]

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]]> By: Carlo Alcos http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-90252 Carlo Alcos Thu, 30 Apr 2009 05:56:42 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-90252 Very perceptive indeed. I like the analogy to America in its infancy - although not sure if I buy that. Take Australian aboriginal art. It's very abstract (I'm no art expert here, but I think it's safe to say they don't look like what they represent). This art has existed before colonization and development, so something is innate there...seemingly. It's very interesting to speculate what we learn from our environment and what we are born with. In the end, it makes you realize that we are all the same...we were just raised in a different place. Very perceptive indeed. I like the analogy to America in its infancy – although not sure if I buy that. Take Australian aboriginal art. It’s very abstract (I’m no art expert here, but I think it’s safe to say they don’t look like what they represent). This art has existed before colonization and development, so something is innate there…seemingly.

It’s very interesting to speculate what we learn from our environment and what we are born with. In the end, it makes you realize that we are all the same…we were just raised in a different place.

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]]> By: Abbie http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/2009/04/29/khmer-kids-why-abstract-thought-is-more-than-you-think/comment-page-1/#comment-90251 Abbie Thu, 30 Apr 2009 05:49:13 +0000 http://www.bravenewtraveler.com/?p=806#comment-90251 Thanks for this post - it came at a good time for me since I'm going to Cambodia in July to teach/volunteer! Thanks for this post – it came at a good time for me since I’m going to Cambodia in July to teach/volunteer!

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